Proposed Elo change

Skrivet av 4nic, 24.04.2020 at 10:12

I agree theres some players who camp on elo, but removing a feature from atwar for no reason makes no sense, or elo reset too for that matter. Often times people who want elo reset have the mentality of "i dont have high elo, so you shouldn't have high elo too" "look at you consistently beating high elo people to maintain your elo" however when i open the elo rankings i see like at least half of the people havent dueled in literal months and months and that might be the problem. i think the solution is to make camping with elo less attractive to people, which is why i propose this idea:

On your in-game profile it shouldn't show your overall elo but instead your seasonal elo, i guarantee the dueling incentive will go up if we do something like this;



It will push for elo campers to play more duels to get their seasonal elo up, not look to gather overall elo and get that "attractive number" of 1500 1600 elo on their profiles.

I dont think players who havent dueled in a long time be punished, when they were active they mopped people to reach the elo peak, now that they got bored of dueling they need to be punished? bad solution... Its stupid and counterintuitive...
so it wouldnt be fair to punish lets say laochra or huarck who havent dueled in months, but rather show their seasonal elo of 1000 on the profile. like this:



Lastly the only place you would be able to see your overall elo is:

Upvote this post to atleast 20 times and our great master Clovis has promised to implement the feature.

This leads to increased duel population, a more accurate value of elo, and increased competitiveness in the duel season.

More people will be dueling to improve the aesthetic of their profile, there's wayyyy to many players who hit 1400 on a whim and refused to duel ever again. Also the Duel season will become a much more prestigious award given to the top 3 players in an active season, not 2 5k shitters and 4nic. Lastly this removes the idea of camping, because if you camp your profile will look bad. I think this idea stimulates the duel environment greatly. Thanks Fellas

Nice Upvote farming

Skrivet av Alex, 21.06.2020 at 14:18

Nice Upvote farming

agreed

COME ON I JUST GOT 1,1K ELO

Wouldn't it be an option to just show both ELO stats?

I've never understood why there is a normal and a seasonal elo just merge that shit

They should not be merged, otherwise people would lose purpose, and I wouldn't duel

Skrivet av Tribune Aquila, 21.06.2020 at 17:24

They should not be merged, otherwise people would lose purpose, and I wouldn't duel

nah people would duel more to keep their elo after a seasonal reset^^

This is clearly popular and some people told me they would duel more if this was implemented, so I'll do my best to have this implemented before next Sunday .

Great job Sphinx!

I still think there should be leaderboard for overall elo

Noooo I don't want to start Medieval dueling again just to have people bitch at me

I disagree. This is copy paste from my responde to the other thread

This is the wrong way to stop elo camping. I'm more in favor of a elo decay system for people who stop dueling. All this does is make it less convenient for the vast majority of players to judge the skill of their opponent.

The way it is now, let just say I'm some average rank 8 no name dueler. If I duel someone and I see they are 1200 elo, I would know they are average strength and around my level.

With the change, I would have to check their profile to figure out how good they are because most if not everybody will be around 1000-1200 elo seasonal.

In the new system, even top player will be around 1100-1300 elo. The average player will have to put extra effort into figuring out the skill of their opponent.

Elo is simply supposed to represent player skill. In games like chess, if I see someone is rated 2000, I know they are pretty good at chess. If people's chess ratings got reset every year, there would be more confusion about the strength of players. You would have to do extra research like see their past games, etc...

Honestly, this change won't really affect me at all. Afterall, why should it. I'm comfortable taking on anyone in a duel.

But you should be careful what you ask for. The average player won't handle this change the same way as I do. This won't be an easy quick fix solution like you think Sphinx.

Lastly, there is nothing wrong about people wanting to have something to be proud of themselves for. It's why people continue to play this game once we get all the upgrades. Once you have enough SP to buy all the upgrades, there really is no reason to continue playing the game except for achievement and accolades. People find values in meaningless pixels like trophies and your elo. Making it harder to show off your elo is the wrong way of stopping campers. It punishes everybody even if they camp or not. Like I said, a simple elo decay system would do the trick without takin away from people's personal satisfaction from their elo

For many people, elo is why they continue to play atwar. Don't punish the many for the action of the few.

Skrivet av Witch-Doctor, 22.06.2020 at 00:34

I actually agree with thzt, makes sense

and beside, even more important

FUCK 4NIC IDEA

What about both ideas ?

Skrivet av Rasp, 21.06.2020 at 15:30

Wouldn't it be an option to just show both ELO stats?

Yes I agree it's best to show both

Skrivet av Witch-Doctor, 22.06.2020 at 00:34

Elo is simply supposed to represent player skill. In games like chess, if I see someone is rated 2000, I know they are pretty good at chess. If people's chess ratings got reset every year, there would be more confusion about the strength of players. You would have to do extra research like see their past games, etc...

Hey WD, just commenting on the comparison to chess. I dont think it is an appropriate comparison for reasons I have mentioned previously on forum. Namely standards. I agree that the intention of the arpad elo system is to arrive at a numeric value which should approximate to skill level. You may even be familiar with the formula and how it is done. Chess has a long history and has put a lot of effort to provide as objective a representation as possible. A simple illustration is even the fact that different time controls have different ratings. So in atwar that would be equivalent of 3k duels having own rating, 5k duels and 10k duels each with separate ratings. Secondly rating is only distributed in chess under TOURNAMENT CONDITIONS. In chess players respond to the STANDARD, they have NO CHOICE. They cannot create their own standard. All proper chess website employ AI which is used as anti cheating mechanism. They log all games of all players and test for patterns to detect cheaters. Another element present in the chess rating process is use of provisional ratings , one must complete a certain number of games before a REAL RATING is applied. The k factor for provisional rating is higher to help players arrive at their true elo faster. As rating increases k factor changes. There is a different k factor used in the calculation of rating depending on which rating group a player falls into. In a game like chess, yes someone's elo is a good measure of strength but this is a very objective system with checks and balances, atwar at present has nothing even close.

Skrivet av DJ003, 22.06.2020 at 11:15

Skrivet av Witch-Doctor, 22.06.2020 at 00:34

Elo is simply supposed to represent player skill. In games like chess, if I see someone is rated 2000, I know they are pretty good at chess. If people's chess ratings got reset every year, there would be more confusion about the strength of players. You would have to do extra research like see their past games, etc...

Hey WD, just commenting on the comparison to chess. I dont think it is an appropriate comparison for reasons I have mentioned previously on forum. Namely standards. I agree that the intention of the arpad elo system is to arrive at a numeric value which should approximate to skill level. You may even be familiar with the formula and how it is done. Chess has a long history and has put a lot of effort to provide as objective a representation as possible. A simple illustration is even the fact that different time controls have different ratings. So in atwar that would be equivalent of 3k duels having own rating, 5k duels and 10k duels each with separate ratings. Secondly rating is only distributed in chess under TOURNAMENT CONDITIONS. In chess players respond to the STANDARD, they have NO CHOICE. They cannot create their own standard. All proper chess website employ AI which is used as anti cheating mechanism. They log all games of all players and test for patterns to detect cheaters. Another element present in the chess rating process is use of provisional ratings , one must complete a certain number of games before a REAL RATING is applied. The k factor for provisional rating is higher to help players arrive at their true elo faster. As rating increases k factor changes. There is a different k factor used in the calculation of rating depending on which rating group a player falls into. In a game like chess, yes someone's elo is a good measure of strength but this is a very objective system with checks and balances, atwar at present has nothing even close.

Atwar is not a game that you can easily cheat. The average person can download stockfish on their phone to cheat at chess, something that requires chess to be heavily regulated. The only regulation atwar needs is to prevent elo feeding and farming. The comparison are valid.

Skrivet av Witch-Doctor, 22.06.2020 at 00:34

Elo is simply supposed to represent player skill. In games like chess, if I see someone is rated 2000, I know they are pretty good at chess. If people's chess ratings got reset every year, there would be more confusion about the strength of players. You would have to do extra research like see their past games, etc...

good point. I take my suggestion back